DEBATE: MASSIACH E MATEUS 2:23 (P IVa)
Fala de teshuva... Para que o Messias venha...
Quando houver muitos frutos e prosperidade o Messias virá...
"R. Giddal said in Rab's name: The Jews are destined to eat [their fill] in the days of the Messiah.21 R. Joseph demurred: is this not obvious; who else then should eat — Hilek and Bilek?22 — This was said in opposition to R. Hillel, who maintained that there will be no Messiah for Israel, since they have already enjoyed him during the reign of Hezekiah.23
Rab said: The world was created only on David's account .24 Samuel said: On Moses account;25 R. Johanan said: For the sake of the Messiah. What is his [the Messiah's] name? — The School of R. Shila said: His name is Shiloh, for it is written, until Shiloh come.26 The School of R. Yannai said: His name is Yinnon, for it is written, His name shall endure for ever:27 e'er the sun was, his name is Yinnon.28 The School of R. Haninah maintained: His name is Haninah, as it is written, Where I will not give you Haninah.29 Others say: His name is Menahem the son of Hezekiah, for it is written, Because Menahem ['the comforter'], that would relieve my soul,is far.30 The Rabbis said: His name is 'the leper scholar,' as it is written, Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him a leper, smitten of God, and afflicted.31" http://
"R. Johanan said: For the sake of the Messiah. What is his [the Messiah's] name? — The School of R. Shila said: His name is Shiloh, for it is written, until Shiloh come. The School of R. Yannai said: His name is Yinnon, for it is written, His name shall endure for ever:27 e'er the sun was, his name is Yinnon. The School of R. Haninah maintained: His name is Haninah, as it is written, Where I will not give you Haninah.29 Others say: His name is Menahem the son of Hezekiah, for it is written, Because Menahem ['the comforter'], that would relieve my soul, is far. The Rabbis said: His name is 'the leper scholar,' as it is written, Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him a leper, smitten of G'd, and afflicted." »»» Que nome o Messias deveria ter. Poderá ser tanto Shiloh, Yinnon, ou Menahem, o filho de Ezequias [ou, porque não, um segundo rei David mas que reinará feliz, gloriosa e eternamente - esta alusão a David não consta do texto em inglês aqui citado], ou mesmo o "leproso escoliasta" chamado assim por causa da vocabilidade para ser humilhado e carregar o fardo do nosso sofrimento e doenças. (Sanhedrin 98b)
Magalhães Luís
EIS A MINHA RESPOSTA ELIEZER.
EIS A MINHA RESPOSTA ELIEZER.
Magalhães Luís
"R. Nahman said: if he [the Messiah] is of those living [to day], it might be one like myself, as it is written, And their nobles shall be of themselves, and their governors shall proceed from the midst of them. Rab said: if he is of the living, it would be our holy Master; if of the dead, it would have been Daniel the most desirable man.34 Rab Judah said in Rab's name: The Holy One, blessed be He, will raise up another David for us, as it is written, But they shall serve the Lord their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them:36 not 'I raised up', but 'I will raise up' is said. R. Papa said to Abaye: But it is written, And my servant David shall be their prince [nasi] for ever? — E.g., an emperor and a viceroy." [FALA DO NOME DANIEL E DE DAVID]
"R. Nahman said: if he [the Messiah] is of those living [to day], it might be one like myself, as it is written, And their nobles shall be of themselves, and their governors shall proceed from the midst of them. Rab said: if he is of the living, it would be our holy Master; if of the dead, it would have been Daniel the most desirable man.34 Rab Judah said in Rab's name: The Holy One, blessed be He, will raise up another David for us, as it is written, But they shall serve the Lord their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them:36 not 'I raised up', but 'I will raise up' is said. R. Papa said to Abaye: But it is written, And my servant David shall be their prince [nasi] for ever? — E.g., an emperor and a viceroy." [FALA DO NOME DANIEL E DE DAVID]
Eliezer Abensur
Meu caro, vamos debater desde o início as citações
Meu caro, vamos debater desde o início as citações
Eliezer Abensur
Onde você acha que tem o que você disse que está escrito em Sanhedrin 98b.
Onde você acha que tem o que você disse que está escrito em Sanhedrin 98b.
Gosto há 2 horas
Magalhães Luís
FIZ O QUE PUDE.
FIZ O QUE PUDE.
Magalhães Luís
Aqui: R. Johanan said: For the sake of the Messiah. What is his [the Messiah's] name? — The School of R. Shila said: His name is Shiloh, for it is written, until Shiloh come. The School of R. Yannai said: His name is Yinnon, for it is written, His name shall endure for ever: e'er the sun was, his name is Yinnon. The School of R. Haninah maintained: His name is Haninah, as it is written, Where I will not give you Haninah.29 Others say: His name is Menahem the son of Hezekiah, for it is written, Because Menahem ['the comforter'], that would relieve my soul,is far. The Rabbis said: His name is 'the leper scholar,' as it is written, Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him a leper, smitten of God, and afflicted. " http://
Aqui: R. Johanan said: For the sake of the Messiah. What is his [the Messiah's] name? — The School of R. Shila said: His name is Shiloh, for it is written, until Shiloh come. The School of R. Yannai said: His name is Yinnon, for it is written, His name shall endure for ever: e'er the sun was, his name is Yinnon. The School of R. Haninah maintained: His name is Haninah, as it is written, Where I will not give you Haninah.29 Others say: His name is Menahem the son of Hezekiah, for it is written, Because Menahem ['the comforter'], that would relieve my soul,is far. The Rabbis said: His name is 'the leper scholar,' as it is written, Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him a leper, smitten of God, and afflicted. " http://
Eliezer Abensur
Vamos conferir as citações
Vamos conferir as citações
Gosto há 2 horas
Magalhães Luís
"R. Nahman said: if he [the Messiah] is of those living [to day], it might be one like myself, as it is written, And their nobles shall be of themselves, and their governors shall proceed from the midst of them. Rab said: if he is of the living, it would be our holy Master; if of the dead, it would have been Daniel the most desirable man.34 Rab Judah said in Rab's name: The Holy One, blessed be He, will raise up another David for us, as it is written, But they shall serve the Lord their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them:36 not 'I raised up', but 'I will raise up' is said. R. Papa said to Abaye: But it is written, And my servant David shall be their prince [nasi] for ever? — E.g., an emperor and a viceroy." [FALA DO NOME DANIEL E DE DAVID]
"R. Nahman said: if he [the Messiah] is of those living [to day], it might be one like myself, as it is written, And their nobles shall be of themselves, and their governors shall proceed from the midst of them. Rab said: if he is of the living, it would be our holy Master; if of the dead, it would have been Daniel the most desirable man.34 Rab Judah said in Rab's name: The Holy One, blessed be He, will raise up another David for us, as it is written, But they shall serve the Lord their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them:36 not 'I raised up', but 'I will raise up' is said. R. Papa said to Abaye: But it is written, And my servant David shall be their prince [nasi] for ever? — E.g., an emperor and a viceroy." [FALA DO NOME DANIEL E DE DAVID]
Eliezer Abensur
Vou facilitar a sua vida
Vou facilitar a sua vida
Magalhães Luís
Grato...
Grato...
Magalhães Luís
Citei do inglês...
Citei do inglês...
Magalhães Luís
Site fidedigno.
Site fidedigno.
Magalhães Luís
"R. Johanan said: For the sake of the Messiah. What is his [the Messiah's] name? — The School of R. Shila said: His name is Shiloh, for it is written, until Shiloh come. The School of R. Yannai said: His name is Yinnon, for it is written, His name shall endure for ever:27 e'er the sun was, his name is Yinnon. The School of R. Haninah maintained: His name is Haninah, as it is written, Where I will not give you Haninah.29 Others say: His name is Menahem the son of Hezekiah, for it is written, Because Menahem ['the comforter'], that would relieve my soul, is far. The Rabbis said: His name is 'the leper scholar,' as it is written, Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him a leper, smitten of G'd, and afflicted." »»» Que nome o Messias deveria ter. Poderá ser tanto Shiloh, Yinnon, ou Menahem, o filho de Ezequias [ou, porque não, um segundo rei David mas que reinará feliz, gloriosa e eternamente - esta alusão a David não consta do texto em inglês no contexto aqui citado], ou mesmo o "leproso escoliasta" chamado assim por causa da vocabilidade para ser humilhado e carregar o fardo do nosso sofrimento e doenças. (Sanhedrin 98b)
"R. Johanan said: For the sake of the Messiah. What is his [the Messiah's] name? — The School of R. Shila said: His name is Shiloh, for it is written, until Shiloh come. The School of R. Yannai said: His name is Yinnon, for it is written, His name shall endure for ever:27 e'er the sun was, his name is Yinnon. The School of R. Haninah maintained: His name is Haninah, as it is written, Where I will not give you Haninah.29 Others say: His name is Menahem the son of Hezekiah, for it is written, Because Menahem ['the comforter'], that would relieve my soul, is far. The Rabbis said: His name is 'the leper scholar,' as it is written, Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him a leper, smitten of G'd, and afflicted." »»» Que nome o Messias deveria ter. Poderá ser tanto Shiloh, Yinnon, ou Menahem, o filho de Ezequias [ou, porque não, um segundo rei David mas que reinará feliz, gloriosa e eternamente - esta alusão a David não consta do texto em inglês no contexto aqui citado], ou mesmo o "leproso escoliasta" chamado assim por causa da vocabilidade para ser humilhado e carregar o fardo do nosso sofrimento e doenças. (Sanhedrin 98b)
Eliezer Abensur
שאין כל דקל ודקל שבבבל שאין םום של
פרסיים נקשר בו ואין לך כל ארון וארון
שבארץ ישראל שאין םום מדי אוכל בו תבן
א )אמר רב אין בן דוד בא עד שתתפשט
המלכות נ< ג<על ישראל תשעה חדשים שנאמר
1לכן יתנם עד עת יולדה ילדה ויתר אחיו
ישובון על בני ישראל אמר עולא ייתי ולא
איחמיניה וכן אמר י•[רבה] ייתי ולא איחמיניה
רב יוםף אמר ייתי ואזכי דאיתיב בטולא
דכופיתא דחמריה אמר ליה אביי (לרבא)
ה<[לרבה] מאי טעמא אילימא משום חבלו
של משיח והתניא שאלו תלמידיו את רבי
אלעזר מה יעשה אדם וינצל מחבלו של
משיח יעסוק בתורה ובגמילות חסדים ומר
הא תורה והא גמילות חסדים אמר [ליה] שמא
יגרום החטא כדר׳ יעקב בר אידי יידר׳ יעקב
בר אידי רמי כתיב 2הנה אנכי עמך ושמרתיך
בכל אשר תלך וכתיב 3ויירא יעקב מאד
וייצר לו שהיה מתיירא שמא ״יגרום החטא
כדתניא 4עד יעבור עמך ה׳ זו ביאה ראשונה
עד יעבור עם זו קנית זו ביאה שניה אמור
מעתה ראויים היו ישראל לעשות להם נס
בביאה שניה כביאה ראשונה אלא שגרם
החטא וכן אמר ר׳ יוחנן ייתי ולא איחמיניה
א״ל ריש לקיש מ״ט אילימא משום דכתיב
5כאשר ינוס איש מפני הארי ופגעו הדוב
[ובא הבית] וסמך ידו אל הקיר ונשכו נחש
בא ואראך דוגמתו בעולם הזה בזמן שאדם
יוצא לשדה ופגע בו סנטר דומה כמי שפגע
בו ארי נכנם לעיר פגע בו גבאי דומה כמי
שפגעו דוב נכנס לביתו ומצא בניו ובנותיו
מוטלין ברעב דומה כמי שנשכו נחש אלא
משום דכתיב 6שאלו נא וראו אם ילד זכר
מדוע ראיתי כל גבר ידיו על חלציו כיולדה
ונהפכו כל פנים לירקון מאי ראיתי כל גבר
אמר רבא בר יצחק אמר רב מי שכל גבורה
שלו ומאי ונהפכו כל פנים לירקון אמר רבי
יוחנן פמליא של מעלה ופמליא של מטה
בשעה שאמר הקב״ה הללו מעשה ידי
והללו מעשה
שאין כל דקל ודקל שבבבל שאין םום של
פרסיים נקשר בו ואין לך כל ארון וארון
שבארץ ישראל שאין םום מדי אוכל בו תבן
א )אמר רב אין בן דוד בא עד שתתפשט
המלכות נ< ג<על ישראל תשעה חדשים שנאמר
1לכן יתנם עד עת יולדה ילדה ויתר אחיו
ישובון על בני ישראל אמר עולא ייתי ולא
איחמיניה וכן אמר י•[רבה] ייתי ולא איחמיניה
רב יוםף אמר ייתי ואזכי דאיתיב בטולא
דכופיתא דחמריה אמר ליה אביי (לרבא)
ה<[לרבה] מאי טעמא אילימא משום חבלו
של משיח והתניא שאלו תלמידיו את רבי
אלעזר מה יעשה אדם וינצל מחבלו של
משיח יעסוק בתורה ובגמילות חסדים ומר
הא תורה והא גמילות חסדים אמר [ליה] שמא
יגרום החטא כדר׳ יעקב בר אידי יידר׳ יעקב
בר אידי רמי כתיב 2הנה אנכי עמך ושמרתיך
בכל אשר תלך וכתיב 3ויירא יעקב מאד
וייצר לו שהיה מתיירא שמא ״יגרום החטא
כדתניא 4עד יעבור עמך ה׳ זו ביאה ראשונה
עד יעבור עם זו קנית זו ביאה שניה אמור
מעתה ראויים היו ישראל לעשות להם נס
בביאה שניה כביאה ראשונה אלא שגרם
החטא וכן אמר ר׳ יוחנן ייתי ולא איחמיניה
א״ל ריש לקיש מ״ט אילימא משום דכתיב
5כאשר ינוס איש מפני הארי ופגעו הדוב
[ובא הבית] וסמך ידו אל הקיר ונשכו נחש
בא ואראך דוגמתו בעולם הזה בזמן שאדם
יוצא לשדה ופגע בו סנטר דומה כמי שפגע
בו ארי נכנם לעיר פגע בו גבאי דומה כמי
שפגעו דוב נכנס לביתו ומצא בניו ובנותיו
מוטלין ברעב דומה כמי שנשכו נחש אלא
משום דכתיב 6שאלו נא וראו אם ילד זכר
מדוע ראיתי כל גבר ידיו על חלציו כיולדה
ונהפכו כל פנים לירקון מאי ראיתי כל גבר
אמר רבא בר יצחק אמר רב מי שכל גבורה
שלו ומאי ונהפכו כל פנים לירקון אמר רבי
יוחנן פמליא של מעלה ופמליא של מטה
בשעה שאמר הקב״ה הללו מעשה ידי
והללו מעשה
Magalhães Luís
Tradução...
Tradução...
Gosto há 2 horas
Eliezer Abensur
Disse Rav que o filho de David não virá antes que se divulguem as Melachot
Disse Rav que o filho de David não virá antes que se divulguem as Melachot
Eliezer Abensur
Desculpe se divulgue o Malchut, o reinado
Desculpe se divulgue o Malchut, o reinado
Eliezer Abensur
Sobre Israel por 9 meses
Sobre Israel por 9 meses
Eliezer Abensur
Conforme está escrito
Conforme está escrito
Magalhães Luís
[...] ontem para anunciar, e ele diz: Eis que eu vos enviarei o profeta Elias, antes que o dia seguinte...
[...] ontem para anunciar, e ele diz: Eis que eu vos enviarei o profeta Elias, antes que o dia seguinte...
Eliezer Abensur
Miquéias 5:2 Therefore, He shall deliver them until the time a woman in confinement gives birth. And the rest of his brothers shall return upon the children of Israel.
Miquéias 5:2 Therefore, He shall deliver them until the time a woman in confinement gives birth. And the rest of his brothers shall return upon the children of Israel.
Eliezer Abensur
Portanto os entregará até ao tempo em que a que está de parto tiver dado à luz; então o restante de seus irmãos voltará aos filhos de Israel.
Portanto os entregará até ao tempo em que a que está de parto tiver dado à luz; então o restante de seus irmãos voltará aos filhos de Israel.
Gosto há 2 horas
Magalhães Luís
Dilma Mbaina real Aiacb - afirma claramente aqui que no momento do messias para atrasar a vinda em um momento e o sabor é Dahari mundo discutida pela maioria dos direitos e, se por um momento fazer uma mitsvá que decidirá o mundo para a direita e parada Julgamento Messias vem, se atrasado pode Enquanto isso, outro seria uma ofensa e será novamente condenar o mundo e não podia vir, o tempo vai ter que esperar até que o mundo vai ser decidido favoravelmente novamente e poderia ter dezenas ou centenas de anos...
Dilma Mbaina real Aiacb - afirma claramente aqui que no momento do messias para atrasar a vinda em um momento e o sabor é Dahari mundo discutida pela maioria dos direitos e, se por um momento fazer uma mitsvá que decidirá o mundo para a direita e parada Julgamento Messias vem, se atrasado pode Enquanto isso, outro seria uma ofensa e será novamente condenar o mundo e não podia vir, o tempo vai ter que esperar até que o mundo vai ser decidido favoravelmente novamente e poderia ter dezenas ou centenas de anos...
Eliezer Abensur
Disse R. Ulah, os entregará e não o entregará
Disse R. Ulah, os entregará e não o entregará
Gosto há 2 horas
Eliezer Abensur
E assim disse Rabá os entregará e não o entregará
E assim disse Rabá os entregará e não o entregará
Magalhães Luís
não Msfikin construí-lo até que Ben David virá - e nós não governaria contra o reino do mal apenas nove meses e depois veio o Messias. O que significa que esses nove meses que o reino do rei do Messias é chamado nas Escrituras de um homem, como ele e longa com nuvens celestes já AINS e acabamentos. Governança como [Daniel] os reis de viver como um rei reino comparou o messias [pessoa]. E a história humana é de nove meses e logo se espalha reino do mal de Israel vai sair e grande rei do messias que ninguém merece
não Msfikin construí-lo até que Ben David virá - e nós não governaria contra o reino do mal apenas nove meses e depois veio o Messias. O que significa que esses nove meses que o reino do rei do Messias é chamado nas Escrituras de um homem, como ele e longa com nuvens celestes já AINS e acabamentos. Governança como [Daniel] os reis de viver como um rei reino comparou o messias [pessoa]. E a história humana é de nove meses e logo se espalha reino do mal de Israel vai sair e grande rei do messias que ninguém merece
Eliezer Abensur
R. Yossef disse "os entregará" pois chegou o limite de seu sofrimento.
R. Yossef disse "os entregará" pois chegou o limite de seu sofrimento.
Eliezer Abensur
E disse Abayê, (em nome de Rabá) qual o significado de dizermos isso? Por causa da obrigação do Mashiach.
E disse Abayê, (em nome de Rabá) qual o significado de dizermos isso? Por causa da obrigação do Mashiach.
Eliezer Abensur
E questionaram sua pergunta seus alunos a Rabi Elazar, o que fará o homem que o salve do ajuste de contas do Mashiach?
E questionaram sua pergunta seus alunos a Rabi Elazar, o que fará o homem que o salve do ajuste de contas do Mashiach?
Eliezer Abensur
E questionaram sua pergunta seus alunos a Rabi Elazar, o que fará o homem que o salve do ajuste de contas do Mashiach?
E questionaram sua pergunta seus alunos a Rabi Elazar, o que fará o homem que o salve do ajuste de contas do Mashiach?
